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Very Interesting (Hormonal Fitness)
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

http://www.hormonalfitness.com/...nal-fitness.htm

high intensity / low volume. scroll down to exercise section

http://www.hormonalfitness.com/...-Chapter-21.pdf
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

The science of insulin sensitivity is far reaching.

Here is a quote to think about, "The major benefits of a properly designed exercise routine are metabolic and hormonal in nature."

Think in those terms when training? Throw mTor activation in for good measure.
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gerry-hitman

Raider22 wrote:
The science of insulin sensitivity is far reaching.

Here is a quote to think about, "The major benefits of a properly designed exercise routine are metabolic and hormonal in nature."

Think in those terms when training? Throw mTor activation in for good measure.


The diet info in this article is very good.

http://www.hormonalfitness.com/...-Chapter-21.pdf

basically the same info as the metabolic diet espoused by dr. Di Pasquale.

Its confirms his teaching that pre and post workout meals should not contain any carbohydrates, as these blunt (kill) fat burning, protein synthesis, and growth hormone output.

Been on this type of diet plan for some time and all I can say about it is...fantastic.
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WesH

Raider22 wrote:
Here is a quote to think about, "The major benefits of a properly designed exercise routine are metabolic and hormonal in nature."


That's pretty much what I got out of "Body by Science." Especially important for old geezers like me. Thanks for the link.
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jastrain

WesH wrote:
Raider22 wrote:
Here is a quote to think about, "The major benefits of a properly designed exercise routine are metabolic and hormonal in nature."

That's pretty much what I got out of "Body by Science." Especially important for old geezers like me. Thanks for the link.


good article --this is what i experienced as well with the high protein /low carb diet. fat burns/ strength increases.
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

scroll down in the article and read the descriptions of volume and intensity and the effects hormonally.
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gerry-hitman

Raider22 wrote:
scroll down in the article and read the descriptions of volume and intensity and the effects hormonally.


I did, and it shows the proof that low volume, Infrequent, High intensity training produces the best hormone profiles.

Great article with lots of facts and science to back it up.

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Raider22

Ohio, USA

I tried the protein drink with whipping cream, olive oil, and protein powder. About two hours after I drank my post workout drink I was doubled over with cramps. I will back off on the whipping cream next time. I don't consume much dairy normally.
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overfiftylifter

I wonder.

http://www.ajcn.org/...stract/91/3/578
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overfiftylifter

I wonder.

Appl. Physiol. Nutr. Metab. 32(6): 1132?1138 (2007)

Minimal whey protein with carbohydrate stimulates muscle protein synthesis following resistance exercise in trained young men

Jason E. Tang, Joshua J. Manolakos, Greg W. Kujbida, Paul J. Lysecki, Daniel R. Moore, and Stuart M. Phillips

Abstract: Whey protein is a supplemental protein source often used by athletes, particularly those aiming to gain muscle mass; however, direct evidence for its efficacy in stimulating muscle protein synthesis (MPS) is lacking. We aimed to determine the impact of consuming whey protein on skeletal muscle protein turnover in the post-exercise period. Eight healthy resistance-trained young men (age = 21 ? 1 .0 years; BMI = 26.8 ? 0.9 kg/m2 (means ? SE)) participated in a double-blind randomized crossover trial in which they performed a unilateral leg resistance exercise workout (EX: 4 sets of knee extensions and 4 sets of leg press; 8?10 repetitions/set; 80% of maximal), such that one leg was not exercised and acted as a rested (RE) comparator. After exercise, subjects consumed either an isoenergetic whey protein plus carbohydrate beverage (WHEY: 10 g protein and 21 g fructose) or a carbohydrate-only beverage (CHO: 21 g fructose and 10 g maltodextran). Subjects received pulse-tracer injections of l-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine and l-[15N]phenylalanine to measure MPS. Exercise stimulated a rise in MPS in the WHEY-EX and CHO-EX legs, which were greater than MPS in the WHEY-RE leg and the CHO-RE leg (all p < 0.05), respectively. The rate of MPS in the WHEY-EX leg was greater than in the CHO-EX leg (p < 0.001). We conclude that a small dose (10 g) of whey protein with carbohydrate (21 g) can stimulate a rise in MPS after resistance exercise in trained young men that would be supportive of a positive net protein balance, which, over time, would lead to hypertrophy.
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overfiftylifter

I wonder.

EUROPEAN JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSIOLOGY
Volume 97, Number 2, 225-238

Independent and combined effects of liquid carbohydrate/essential amino acid ingestion on hormonal and muscular adaptations following resistance training in untrained men
Stephen P. Bird, Kyle M. Tarpenning and Frank E. Marino

Abstract
This investigation examined chronic alteration of the acute hormonal response associated with liquid carbohydrate (CHO) and/or essential amino acid (EAA) ingestion on hormonal and muscular adaptations following resistance training. Thirty-two untrained young men performed 12 weeks of resistance training twice a week, consuming ~675 ml of either, a 6% CHO solution, 6 g EAA mixture, combined CHO + EAA supplement or placebo (PLA). Blood samples were obtained pre- and post-exercise (week 0, 4, 8, and 12), for determination of glucose, insulin, and cortisol. 3-Methylhistidine excretion and muscle fibre cross-sectional area (fCSA) were determined pre- and post-training. Post-exercise cortisol increased (P<0.05) during each training phase for PLA. No change was displayed by EAA; CHO and CHO + EAA demonstrated post-exercise decreases (P<0.05). All groups displayed reduced pre-exercise cortisol at week 12 compared to week 0 (P<0.05). Post-exercise insulin concentrations showed no change for PLA; increases were observed for the treatment groups (P<0.05), which remained greater for CHO and CHO + EAA (P<0.001) than PLA. EAA and CHO ingestion attenuated 3-methylhistidine excretion 48 h following the exercise bout. CHO + EAA resulted in a 26% decrease (P<0.01), while PLA displayed a 52% increase (P<0.01). fCSA increased across groups for type I, IIa, and IIb fibres (P<0.05), with CHO + EAA displaying the greatest gains in fCSA relative to PLA (P<0.05). These data indicate that CHO + EAA ingestion enhances muscle anabolism following resistance training to a greater extent than either CHO or EAA consumed independently. The synergistic effect of CHO + EAA ingestion maximises the anabolic response presumably by attenuating the post-exercise rise in protein degradation.
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Joseph Anderson


Appl. Physiol. Nutr. Metab. 32(6): 1132?1138 (2007)

We aimed to determine the impact of consuming whey protein on skeletal muscle protein turnover in the post-exercise period . . .

After exercise, subjects consumed either an isoenergetic whey protein plus carbohydrate beverage (WHEY: 10 g protein and 21 g fructose) or a carbohydrate-only beverage (CHO: 21 g fructose and 10 g maltodextran).


If there aim was to determine the impact of consuming whey protein, why not have a group consume 31g of whey protein only and compare the results???

I'm guessing a protein only group would have fared better . . .

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AShortt

Ontario, CAN

Interesting

Regards,
Andrew
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Tomislav

New York, USA

Add garlic powder to the whey protein...

http://www.1vigor.com/...ally/index.html
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

I am Italian, this could be the Italian protein drink. Whey, Olive Oil, and Garlic. Tasty
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gerry-hitman

If there ever was such a thing as the "holy grail" of bodybuilding/strength/training/fitness, the info in this article would be it.

It covers all the bases; brief, intense, infrequent weight training, combined with a 22 century diet system.

For example I believe Mike Mentzer and others would have embraced the realities and great advantages of these kind of diets if they would have researched and tested them further.

Mike taught a calorie is a calorie. He was wrong about that. While calories surely DO count, the way in which the 3 nutrient groups react in the body especially in the hormonal responses they produce differs GREATLY between.
them.

To deny or ignore the importance of hormonal effects as it relates to bodybuilding is foolish.

This kind of eating is especially great for those who did not have an athletic background and was over weight or obese for periods of time in their life.

But ANY natural bodybuilder can benefit greatly from application of this. knoledge.
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markh

After a quick glance through the original articles and a look at the pre and post workout nutrition part, its focus seems to be on fat burning during a workout.(please correct me if this assumption is wrong)
Surely the goal of us here when training is hypertrophy of the muscles and not fat burning . As both protein and carbs provide important roles in the release and potentiation of growth hormone then to my mind it makes sense to consume both in all meals(including pre and post workout). Obviously if one is trying to lose bodyfat then insulin control becomes a major factor and a lower carb or carb cycling approach may well be the best option for some people,although there are many such as myself who have reached very low bodyfat with a pretty high carb intake (250/270 grams a day).

Mark H
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gerry-hitman

markh wrote:
After a quick glance through the original articles and a look at the pre and post workout nutrition part, its focus seems to be on fat burning during a workout.(please correct me if this assumption is wrong)
Surely the goal of us here when training is hypertrophy of the muscles and not fat burning . As both protein and carbs provide important roles in the release and potentiation of growth hormone then to my mind it makes sense to consume both in all meals(including pre and post workout). Obviously if one is trying to lose bodyfat then insulin control becomes a major factor and a lower carb or carb cycling approach may well be the best option for some people,although there are many such as myself who have reached very low bodyfat with a pretty high carb intake (250/270 grams a day).

Mark H


The focus is on BOTH fat burning AND increasing the anabolic hormone production; protein synthesis was found to INCREASE in the absence of carbs both pre-and post workout
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gerry-hitman

mark, from what i have learned, which is plenty on this subject in the past 2 years; if i were a competitive bodybuilder such as yourself looking for an edge, I would seriously look into this.

glancing at an article and making judgement without reading the full story will never lead you to any benefit.

It is true that any nutrient ration even high carb ones, when combines with low calorie diet will produce fat loss, and many have got lean cutting and cutting ever lower on calories.

But for the natural bodybuilder this poses problems.

Can you maintain that leanness year around on such a low calorie diet?

Can you honestly say you did not lose considerable muscle on the way down to competition leanness?

Can you build muscle while on the very low calorie portions of your cutting cycle?

With these type of phase shift diets starvation is NOT necessary to get and stay lean all year long, even in the off season.

The 3 nutrients are partitioned in such a way as to maximize their effects for BOTH fat loss (your metabolism becomes fat burning), and anabolic effect using insulin spikes (during carb loading phase), as well as Test boosting from the high fat diet effect.

And there is much more.

But in order to know if this will IMPROVE your competitiveness or not you will need to study this from sources who have well researched and designed these diets, otherwise you get only bias opinions
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gerry-hitman

Pre-workout for me is a an amino acid mix no carbs. I drink a EAA mix throughout workout no carbs. Post workout Im drink a very pure whey isolate with zero sugar no flavor or anything, just pure whey. The taste is OK tastes a little like evap milk but not strong.

Then hour later I eat a high protein/fat meal, usually steak or ground beef and plenty of it; ZERO carbs or maybe 1 or 2 grams from the ketchup:)

Then before bed 1 can of tuna with lots of natural full fat real mayo. And usually 2-3 fried jumbo eggs with yolks of course and NO carbs.

Next morning I have BIG carb meal
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

gerry-hitman wrote:
Pre-workout for me is a an amino acid mix no carbs. I drink a EAA mix throughout workout no carbs. Post workout Im drink a very pure whey isolate with zero sugar no flavor or anything, just pure whey. The taste is OK tastes a little like evap milk but not strong.

Then hour later I eat a high protein/fat meal, usually steak or ground beef and plenty of it; ZERO carbs or maybe 1 or 2 grams from the ketchup:)


Then before bed 1 can of tuna with lots of natural full fat real mayo. And usually 2-3 fried jumbo eggs with yolks of course and NO carbs.

Next morning I have BIG carb meal


Good info, thanks. The article stated that carb loading should be done with the last meal of the day. I do notice if I eat carbs late, I sleep great. Probably the serotonin that was talked about with carb response.
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Turpin

Raider22 wrote:
I tried the protein drink with whipping cream, olive oil, and protein powder. About two hours after I drank my post workout drink I was doubled over with cramps. I will back off on the whipping cream next time. I don't consume much dairy normally.


I had similar result Raider .
over the years After reading lots of positives re; the `anabolic` diet I really wanted to give it a go , but each time I get bloated , constipated and really out of sorts ( irritable ) and despite having tried/persevered for many weeks I ultimately had to resort back to my 60/25/15 ratio diet ( which for ME I find healthier ).
My preference is to take in higher carbs A.M when I need them ( oats , bananas , breads ) thru till lunch and then its steamed veggies/protein only thereafter.

I was also always of the opinion that post workout & in a glycogen depleted state one is more catabolic than anabolic and therefore the ideal post workout food is/would be nutrient dense in both carbohydrate and protein in order to replenish the now depleted glycogen.
And that pre-workout , carbohydrate is the fuel of choice for strong mucular contractions.

T.
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Raider22

Ohio, USA

Some resent conversations and reading has me re-thinking my approach. Think about training and nutrition choices and how they impact the following:

mTOR activation
Increasing Growth Hormone
Decreasing Insulin
Decreasing Cortisol
Conserving ATP

A molecular and hormonal approach.

Classic HIT addresses many of the above processes. Nutrition and it's timing is something I am going to experiment with.

I would love to hear all of your perspectives on impacting the above qualities.
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gerry-hitman

Raider22 wrote:
gerry-hitman wrote:
Pre-workout for me is a an amino acid mix no carbs. I drink a EAA mix throughout workout no carbs. Post workout Im drink a very pure whey isolate with zero sugar no flavor or anything, just pure whey. The taste is OK tastes a little like evap milk but not strong.

Then hour later I eat a high protein/fat meal, usually steak or ground beef and plenty of it; ZERO carbs or maybe 1 or 2 grams from the ketchup:)


Then before bed 1 can of tuna with lots of natural full fat real mayo. And usually 2-3 fried jumbo eggs with yolks of course and NO carbs.

Next morning I have BIG carb meal


Good info, thanks. The article stated that carb loading should be done with the last meal of the day. I do notice if I eat carbs late, I sleep great. Probably the serotonin that was talked about with carb response.


Ok i will try the carb load at the last meal instead of the first, its true the carbs make me somewhat tired for a while after eating, so could be a great sleep aid.
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markh

Thanks for the detailed reply Gerry.

I would be interested in seeing what "natural" bodybuilders have used this approach to achieve "contest condition" as in my own experience the vast majority of bodybuilders i know who have used a very low carb approach have appeared on stage looking flat and stringy (this doesn`t mean the "metabolic diet" wouldn`t work as i don`t know if any were following this particular diet but it`s necessary for me to mention it as i`ve seen it happen on very low carb diets numerous times).
As for my higher carb approach i`m more than happy with the results and see no reason to change it
I stay pretty lean off season (very lean compared to the average bodybuilder)and diet on fairly high calories . I usually start at around the 2700 mark and expect to be consuming close to 3000 per day by the end of the competitive season.I`m rarely hungry and sometimes it`s an effort to fit all the meals in.
I will eat a wide variety of foods (meats, fish, fruit, veg, oats,rice bread, milk, potatoes,potatoes and protein powder) right up to and including contest day.
The effect is that i maintain my strength up to the contest and with it most of my lean mass, my energy levels are high and muscles are full, dry and vascular throughout the day. In fact the pumps i get during workouts can be extreme at times.

The degree of leanness i achieve (provided i stick to the diet) is normally dependent on how lean i am to start and how long i`m on the diet

Best Wishes
Mark H

gerry-hitman wrote:
mark, from what i have learned, which is plenty on this subject in the past 2 years; if i were a competitive bodybuilder such as yourself looking for an edge, I would seriously look into this.

glancing at an article and making judgement without reading the full story will never lead you to any benefit.

It is true that any nutrient ration even high carb ones, when combines with low calorie diet will produce fat loss, and many have got lean cutting and cutting ever lower on calories.

But for the natural bodybuilder this poses problems.

Can you maintain that leanness year around on such a low calorie diet?

Can you honestly say you did not lose considerable muscle on the way down to competition leanness?

Can you build muscle while on the very low calorie portions of your cutting cycle?

With these type of phase shift diets starvation is NOT necessary to get and stay lean all year long, even in the off season.

The 3 nutrients are partitioned in such a way as to maximize their effects for BOTH fat loss (your metabolism becomes fat burning), and anabolic effect using insulin spikes (during carb loading phase), as well as Test boosting from the high fat diet effect.

And there is much more.

But in order to know if this will IMPROVE your competitiveness or not you will need to study this from sources who have well researched and designed these diets, otherwise you get only bias opinions


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