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Determine the Length of Your Workouts

Evaluate Your Progress

Keep Warm-Up in Perspective


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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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mentzer's boy

Hi, I decided for this routine, it's okay?
w / o 1: Deadlift
chest press machine
4-5 days off

w / o 2: Squats
underhand pulldown


I have a question about these warm-up exercises series.I train without breaks or I have included a series of warm-up and working and then move to the next exercise and do a warm-up series and then a series of working?

Thanks.
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larsvonthreat

Looks good to me.I did something similar for months and had good results.
I did dips/deadlift and 7 days later chins/squat.
You could also substitute leg press for squat.


For warmups I did one to three warmup sets(light medium heavy)before the working set.Then I moved to the next exercise.

I used three warmups for squats and deadlift and one or two for chins and dips.I didn't not rush between exercises.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

mentzer's boy wrote:
Hi, I decided for this routine, it's okay?
w / o 1: Deadlift
chest press machine
4-5 days off

w / o 2: Squats
underhand pulldown


I have a question about these warm-up exercises series.I train without breaks or I have included a series of warm-up and working and then move to the next exercise and do a warm-up series and then a series of working?

Thanks.


==Scott==
I don't question that that kind of workout could work for you, I just don't understand how you could be satisfied only doing so little each workout whether it worked or not. That kind of workout would bore me to tears.
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J-son

So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas


==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.
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Mega-duty

When you break your previous best every workout it is fun,no matter how little you do.It also really gives a feeling of achievement.
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J-son

entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas

==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and
results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can
have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always
wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.


Personaly I wouldent train without result. Im quite sure that if its fun I want, I can easily say 100 things on top of my head that its more fun then training.

Still I like to train (for results) dont misunderstand me there, and going back to a Nautilus gym, trying to duplicate Ren-Ex style has been more fun then ever. Probably just different personalitys, y

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DNAHelix

New York, USA

entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas

==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.


I am with you all the way Scott. I like working out. 10 minutes once a week would be extremely counter productive in my case.
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

Mega-duty wrote:
When you break your previous best every workout it is fun,no matter how little you do.It also really gives a feeling of achievement.


As long as I continue to do so at 6 exercises/workout, I will!
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

J-son wrote:
entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas

==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and
results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can
have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always
wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.

Personaly I wouldent train without result. Im quite sure that if its fun I want, I can easily say 100 things on top of my head that its more fun then training.

Still I like to train (for results) dont misunderstand me there, and going back to a Nautilus gym, trying to duplicate Ren-Ex style has been more fun then ever. Probably just different personalitys, y



Personaly I wouldent train without result

==Scott==
If I felt that way I would have quit long ago. If I looked back at my workout log from day one and calculated how much I actually have gotten bigger or stronger it would seem pretty pathetic. I have times where I make progress and that's great but there are times where I don't make any progress. The results that really matter to me is the good feeling I get from working out regardless if the weight goes up or not. As Arnold said a good workout is right up there with good sex.
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

[THE FOLLOWING GOES WITH MY PREVIOUS POST, THOUGH AT FIRST GLANCE IT MAY NOT SEEM TO.]

Strength and size gains are NOT continuous in the long run --- only relative to your current (i.e. acute) time frame. It's silly to expect otherwise, despite the false hope planted by Mike in HDII (one of a handful of things he said that I vehemently disagree with).

Overall, your gains shall be a series of 3-4 steps forward, followed by 1-2 steps back. Always. Deal with it.

Unfortunately, as we get older the steps forward will increase and the steps back may increase.

To expect continuous increases from the time you pick-up the iron until the time you die is to be totally out of touch with reality.

Like the other Scott I love the huffing and puffing and pumped-up sweaty feeling that comes from a good workout. That does NOT happen in a 2-set session --- I know, I've tried it.

Scott
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HeavyHitter32

When I was in my early 20s, I could do pretty well with really consolidated training. However, as I approach 40 (next year), such training leaves me looking untrained and flat. I would assume it's because of my lower hormone profile as I know for a fact based on blood work my T levels are lower than they once were.

When T levels are higher, presumably ANY sort of half reasonable training can give results especially in early 20s. Or, my body just became accustomed to such training and needed something else over time. I did consolidation training for about 4-5 years back in those days.
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marcrph

Portugal

HH32,

I think Mentzer got some of the equation right.

2-3 exercises was very good

However, sets over 5 reps develop strength/endurance factors. Mentzer could not have been well versed in the energy systems, for he never wrote about these. High rep sets (greater than 15 reps) develop endurance factors. Thus squats or deadlifts done for high reps would develop slow twitch fibers along with fast twitch glycolytic IIA fibers. The anaerobic fast twitch fibers IIB are not targeted by Mentzer's CR protocol. So.......how do you mend a broken heart?

Simple.

Keep two exercises
Deadlifts and dips

Stick to 5 reps or less Non-Failure to promote recovery, with 2-3 reps being ideal. This targets the type IIB fibers, which have the largest capacity for growth. This also diminishes lactic acid output from the muscles themselves. Finally, cortisol is diminished with such a protocol.

Multiple sets......proven empirically
Frequent WO's......possible due to alactic protocol
Longer rest intervals(5 minutes)....allow for phosphagen (ATP) replenishment between sets. Facilitates more weight lifted.

This looks like a power/strength program.....which is what everyone but (ugh!) bodybuilders should be doing.
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Lioncourt

simon-hecubus wrote:
Like the other Scott I love the huffing and puffing and pumped-up sweaty feeling that comes from a good workout. That does NOT happen in a 2-set session --- I know, I've tried it.


If you're using 300 and 400+ pound squats or deadlifts at each session like you eventually will on such a program you'll be huffing and puffing plenty after your sets. The pump is only 10% of the growth you will ever get, why worry about it?
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Lioncourt

mentzer's boy wrote:
Hi, I decided for this routine, it's okay?
w / o 1: Deadlift
chest press machine
4-5 days off

w / o 2: Squats
underhand pulldown


I have a question about these warm-up exercises series.I train without breaks or I have included a series of warm-up and working and then move to the next exercise and do a warm-up series and then a series of working?

Thanks.


My only suggestion with that is to switch to dips or a bench press variation instead of the chest machine and chins instead of the pulldown. On such an abbreviated program I would prefer to do as many free weight exercises as possible.

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Turpin

Ive been using consolidated/abbreviated training for many years now. Ive tried many times to up the volume and/or frequency but I keep coming back to my same old routine of what Ive found to be the most productive exercises.

Upperbody;
Chins
Dips
High pull or OHP

lowerbody;
Belt squat or the leg press
Donkey calf raise
Weighted hypers

At present my routine is an upper/lower split ( which has helped my recuperation no end )

T.
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

Lioncourt wrote:
If you're using 300 and 400+ pound squats or deadlifts at each session like you eventually will on such a program you'll be huffing and puffing plenty after your sets. The pump is only 10% of the growth you will ever get, why worry about it?


I'm doing 375 on DLs and 405 on Lever Squats. I H&P plenty for about 1-2 minutes afterwards. Some what? It ain't the same conditioning factor as following that set with 5 more.

Bottom Line: I LIKE doing 6 different exercises each workout. That's all the reason I need.

I never said anything about the pump and growth and whether I worry about it or not (I don't). I LIKE the way it feels and it lets me know I've targeted the right area(s). However, I'm sure it accounts for more than 10%* --- thank you Rush Limcourt, for pulling that number out of your wazoo.

(*LA's place in muscle growth has yet to be fully understood AND 'the Pump' is a good LA indicator)
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marcrph

Portugal

simon-hecubus wrote:
(*LA's place in muscle growth has yet to be fully understood AND 'the Pump' is a good LA indicator)


Lactic acid may not be "fully understood," but is everything known about any part of the human.....No. We know enough about lactic acid to influence our training protocols.

The "burn" is indicative of lactic acid production....not the "pump."
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DNAHelix

New York, USA

simon-hecubus wrote:
Like the other Scott I love the huffing and puffing and pumped-up sweaty feeling that comes from a good workout. That does NOT happen in a 2-set session --- I know, I've tried it.
Scott


Very true, 2 sets would not do anything for me.
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DNAHelix

New York, USA

HeavyHitter32 wrote:
However, as I approach 40 (next year), such training leaves me looking untrained and flat.


Same here.

I would like to add in here, Mentzer himself used to do a ton of sets in one workout, took him decades to get to CR.

<p><font size="4">The number of sets is strictly individual, some people need 2-3 some people might need 12!</font></p>
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Tony Williams

entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas

==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and
results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can
have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always
wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.

Personaly I wouldent train without result. Im quite sure that if its fun I want, I can easily say 100 things on top of my head that its more fun then training.

Still I like to train (for results) dont misunderstand me there, and going back to a Nautilus gym, trying to duplicate Ren-Ex style has been more fun then ever. Probably just different personalitys, y



Personaly I wouldent train without result

==Scott==
If I felt that way I would have quit long ago. If I looked back at my workout log from day one and calculated how much I actually have gotten bigger or stronger it would seem pretty pathetic. I have times where I make progress and that's great but there are times where I don't make any progress. The results that really matter to me is the good feeling I get from working out regardless if the weight goes up or not. As Arnold said a good workout is right up there with good sex.


Arnold was mistaken on the last point.

Tony

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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

marcrph wrote:
The "burn" is indicative of lactic acid production....not the "pump."


Burn. Pump. Facets of the same thing.

The pump is a combo of blood and LA which follows the burn. The pump is the end result. I like to describe it in happy terms. It's a "glass-1/2-full" kind of thing.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Tony Williams wrote:
entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
entsminger wrote:
J-son wrote:
So, are you training for the sake of training or are you training for result?

My point is: whatever program you do, if you get result (Im guessing result equals more muscle in this case), it will be fun. Any routine that dont give results will be boring in the long run IMHO of course.

//Jonas

==Scott==
If you are talking to me I train for both fun and
results. I love using most all my machines and even my dumbells and it would just kill me to limit myself to just squats, deadlift and chin or whatever regardless if I gained muscle or not. Unlike what Jones may have said I think one can
have fun lifting and make good gains.I have more fun doing more than less. I tried several times just doing bench, chins and one other exercise and lost interest very quickly. I always
wonder when I hear of these guys who are in and out of the gym after their super abbreviated workouts. I guess if you really don't enjoy lifting that's great but I enjoy doing it to much to make my once a week workout only last minutes.

Personaly I wouldent train without result. Im quite sure that if its fun I want, I can easily say 100 things on top of my head that its more fun then training.

Still I like to train (for results) dont misunderstand me there, and going back to a Nautilus gym, trying to duplicate Ren-Ex style has been more fun then ever. Probably just different personalitys, y



Personaly I wouldent train without result

==Scott==
If I felt that way I would have quit long ago. If I looked back at my workout log from day one and calculated how much I actually have gotten bigger or stronger it would seem pretty pathetic. I have times where I make progress and that's great but there are times where I don't make any progress. The results that really matter to me is the good feeling I get from working out regardless if the weight goes up or not. As Arnold said a good workout is right up there with good sex.

Arnold was mistaken on the last point.

Tony



==Scott==
Not in my opinion, I love the feeling I get from a good pump!! For me it's right up there with good sex. Why else do you think I've kept at it for over 40 years? It sure ain't because of the records I've broken..not..or the "huge" size I've amassed, ha ha..That's why I've always disagreed with Jones on his contention that you gotta suffer to workout right. BS...If you're not enjoying your workout you are doing it wrong!!!
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

entsminger wrote:
Not in my opinion, I love the feeling I get from a good pump!! For me it's right up there with good sex. Why else do you think I've kept at it for over 40 years? It sure ain't because of the records I've broken..not..or the "huge" size I've amassed, ha ha..That's why I've always disagreed with Jones on his contention that you gotta suffer to workout right. BS...If you're not enjoying your workout you are doing it wrong!!!


Hear, hear. Leave all that macho $#!+ to the pit-bull-walking, UFC-watching crowd.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

simon-hecubus wrote:
entsminger wrote:
Not in my opinion, I love the feeling I get from a good pump!! For me it's right up there with good sex. Why else do you think I've kept at it for over 40 years? It sure ain't because of the records I've broken..not..or the "huge" size I've amassed, ha ha..That's why I've always disagreed with Jones on his contention that you gotta suffer to workout right. BS...If you're not enjoying your workout you are doing it wrong!!!

Hear, hear. Leave all that macho $#!+ to the pit-bull-walking, UFC-watching crowd.


==Scott==
Huh?? There's nothing macho in what I'm saying. Quite the contrary,if you're hating your workouts, not enjoying your workouts but doing them anyway to make gains, that more qualifies as macho or just plain dumb, ha ha..
From one Scott to another you know what I'm talking about when I say I love my workouts. What better feeling is there to get than the feeling you get standing there with muscles pumped up, sweaty and engorged with blood and you know you've given it your all?
By the way, I focus more on the "Swamp People" crowd than the UFC crowd, ha ha...
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