MB Madaera
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Built 11.7 lbs muscle


Chris Madaera
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Keelan Parham
Lost 30 lbs fat
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Bob Marchesello
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Jeff Turner
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Jeanenne Darden
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Ted Tucker
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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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entsminger

Virginia, USA

You asked what else - three large meals which in his case consist of raw chicken, raw liver, raw beef, raw butter (looks yellow), etc. He also pointed out that 24 eggs wasn't that much for him and he could eat more.

==Scott==
I think people trying to build muscle eat way more protein than they need to. I can't remember how much protein a typical body needs a day but 24 eggs and all that meat seems way to much and we aren't even talking the veggies and other things they need yet. Yea, they might feel bigger but most likely it's fat they are putting on when they eat to much protein , not muscle.
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Brian Johnston

Ontario, CAN

Tomislov, I know you're a bit daft, but I'll try to make this clear. You are what you are, which is not calling names. I wish I could talk training with you, but you make up things and exaggerate, just like you think all your fat will one day become muscle. The Gambler's Fallacy.

When did Josh bulk up BEYOND WHAT HE EVER DID IN THE PAST? Please provide a time line and evidence, expert.

Josh started his raw food diet a year or so ago, not when he turned pro several years back... and you claim he has advanced nutrition knowledge, lol (which must be only a year or so ago and not before). I'm not saying he doesn't know nutrition, but his direction has CHANGED over the past year or so, along with his training approach and overall philosophy. Which is the stimulus? Prove it.

You talk about bodybuilders on DRUGS (Priest, Scott, and even Grimek) when it comes to bulking and building... now... mention a NATURAL athlete who has produced good change with bulking that could not have been achieved without bulking. How about yourself... show the before and after photos, expert.
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duesingbc

Illinois, USA

I wonder if Josh is going to get a lower back tramp stamp that says "REN" with a baby blue thong that has a giant "X" on the ass cheeks. One can only hope...
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Tomislav

New York, USA

farhad wrote:
Tomislav,

Let's not get into a debate about training methods. I'll post a pic when I can.

Josh is not an athlete who trains(in any manner) 1-2 hours a day. I am guessing 1-2 hours a week, right? He is not an ectomorph. He does not need 5,000+ calories to increase his muscle mass.

Taking in that much cholesterol has to have some kind of negative effect on the body's own cholesterol production.

Paleo run a mock....but to each his own.

Farhad,
who said anything about training methods? We're talking about muscle building nutrition.

Training frequency isn't the issue here either, muscle needs to eat.

Each pound of lean mass you add requires 50 calories/day for maintenance alone, so an advanced athlete with 50 lbs of additional muscle is going to need an extra 2,500 calories a day just to maintain it on top of their previous caloric requirements.

Requiring over 5,000 calories a day for growth is not unusual for a muscular athlete over 200 lbs.

In BIG, Ellington took a natural athlete (Eddie Mueller)who was much smaller (170 lbs) and brought him up to 190 lbs using up to 6,000 calories/day.

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Tomislav

New York, USA

Brian Johnston wrote:
Tomislov, I know you're a bit daft, but I'll try to make this clear. You are what you are, which is not calling names. I wish I could talk training with you, but you make up things and exaggerate, just like you think all your fat will one day become muscle. The Gambler's Fallacy.

When did Josh bulk up BEYOND WHAT HE EVER DID IN THE PAST? Please provide a time line and evidence, expert.

I discussed nutrition and raw food with Josh in 2010 so it looks like the timeframe was at least 3 years of bulkbuilding.

Josh started his raw food diet a year or so ago

Perhaps ask him.

, not when he turned pro several years back... and you claim he has advanced nutrition knowledge, lol (which must be only a year or so ago and not before). I'm not saying he doesn't know nutrition, but his direction has CHANGED over the past year or so, along with his training approach and overall philosophy. Which is the stimulus? Prove it.

You talk about bodybuilders on DRUGS (Priest, Scott, and even Grimek) when it comes to bulking and building... now... mention a NATURAL athlete who has produced good change with bulking that could not have been achieved without bulking. How about yourself... show the before and after photos, expert.


Grimek was natural beyond experimenting with Ziegler's early attempts (which didn't agree with him anyway) and Scott only took 5 mg of dbol; they both relied on bulking up because they knew that you didn't need steroids to build muscle, just heavy weights and a gallon of Milk a day on top of your regular meals.

Has this changed?
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Brian Johnston

Ontario, CAN

What the bodybuilders said they took and WHAT they took are two different things. That never changed, Mr. Gullible (I worked with pro bodybuilders and know a bit more about that then you do).

Back in 2010 Josh also was talking about the great things he did with me at my place... take that for whatever it's worth, but it's a FACT that you cannot indicate what produced results... the bulking... an increase in quality nutrition... a change in training... a change in psychology and philosophy.

It's interesting that NO ONE on this site (to my knowledge) credits getting FAT with gaining muscle to any degree except yourself. I guess you're the all-knowing guru, Mr. Six Pack (still waiting for that photo, and make sure it's a full torso shot in focus).
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farhad

Massachusetts, USA

Tomislav wrote:
Training frequency isn't the issue here either, muscle needs to eat.

REALLY?? REALLY?? so it makes no difference if one works out once a week or 6 days a week, protein and calorie requirements don't change. RIIIGHT.

Each pound of lean mass you add requires 50 calories/day for maintenance alone, so an advanced athlete with 50 lbs of additional muscle is going to need an extra 2,500 calories a day just to maintain it on top of their previous caloric requirements.

THAT 50 CALORIES FOR EACH PUND OF MUSCLE IS A MYTH. IT'S MORE LIKE 5-15 (AT MOST).

Requiring over 5,000 calories a day for growth is not unusual for a muscular athlete over 200 lbs.

FOR ATHLETES SUCH AS NFL LINEMEN, THAT MAY BE TRUE, BUT NOT FOR SOMEONE LIKE JOSH.

In BIG, Ellington took a natural athlete (Eddie Mueller)who was much smaller (170 lbs) and brought him up to 190 lbs using up to 6,000 calories/day.

I HAVE NOT READ BIG SO I DO NOT KNOW DETAILS AND CAN'T COMMENT



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entsminger

Virginia, USA

===Scott==
When I was in my 20's and working out hard I somehow had the money to buy all the supplements, powders etc etc that I wanted and I took loads of it. At least twice a day I was drinking a concoction of brewers yeast, protein powders, banana's,and even some amino acids and liver tablets etc.

I'd have a good breakfast with eggs etc, tuna etc for lunch and most likely a steak or chicken etc at dinner. Later I couldn't afford all that and the only difference I found muscle wise was that I was alot fatter and more broke with all the supplements.

The only supplement I take today when I can afford them is dessicated liver tablets and some vitamins.Excess protein is either pissed out or turned to fat.
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Tika

Florida, USA

Brian Johnston wrote:
What the bodybuilders said they took and WHAT they took are two different things. That never changed, Mr. Gullible (I worked with pro bodybuilders and know a bit more about that then you do).

Back in 2010 Josh also was talking about the great things he did with me at my place... take that for whatever it's worth, but it's a FACT that you cannot indicate what produced results... the bulking... an increase in quality nutrition... a change in training... a change in psychology and philosophy.

It's interesting that NO ONE on this site (to my knowledge) credits getting FAT with gaining muscle to any degree except yourself. I guess you're the all-knowing guru, Mr. Six Pack (still waiting for that photo, and make sure it's a full torso shot in focus).



Hi Brian,

I was on that trip with Josh, I believe it was the year 2007. I will be happy to post info about Josh's diet/bulk over the last 5 years if anyone is interested.

Tika
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Brian Johnston

Ontario, CAN

Josh just sent me an email... it was in 2007 (how time flies). I guess him getting super fat (according to Tomislob) was the reason for gaining muscle. No need for expensive equipment or change in protocol... just a ton of calories will make you big and muscular.
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Tika

Florida, USA

Tomislav wrote:
Brian Johnston wrote:
Tomislov, I know you're a bit daft, but I'll try to make this clear. You are what you are, which is not calling names. I wish I could talk training with you, but you make up things and exaggerate, just like you think all your fat will one day become muscle. The Gambler's Fallacy.

When did Josh bulk up BEYOND WHAT HE EVER DID IN THE PAST? Please provide a time line and evidence, expert.

I discussed nutrition and raw food with Josh in 2010 so it looks like the timeframe was at least 3 years of bulkbuilding.

Josh started his raw food diet a year or so ago

Perhaps ask him.

, not when he turned pro several years back... and you claim he has advanced nutrition knowledge, lol (which must be only a year or so ago and not before). I'm not saying he doesn't know nutrition, but his direction has CHANGED over the past year or so, along with his training approach and overall philosophy. Which is the stimulus? Prove it.

You talk about bodybuilders on DRUGS (Priest, Scott, and even Grimek) when it comes to bulking and building... now... mention a NATURAL athlete who has produced good change with bulking that could not have been achieved without bulking. How about yourself... show the before and after photos, expert.

Grimek was natural beyond experimenting with Ziegler's early attempts (which didn't agree with him anyway) and Scott only took 5 mg of dbol; they both relied on bulking up because they knew that you didn't need steroids to build muscle, just heavy weights and a gallon of Milk a day on top of your regular meals.

Has this changed?



Hi Tomi,

Josh has been a raw food eater for just over 5 years. I believe he got 60 pounds over his previous contest weight.

Tika
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Tomislav

New York, USA

Tika wrote:
Hi Tomi,
Josh has been a raw food eater for just over 5 years. I believe he got 60 pounds over his previous contest weight.

Tika


Tika,
thanks for confirming; regardless of sour graps on the thread Josh did a great job illustrating what's possible with bulkbuilding and quality nutrition.

No doubt it would have been much easier to stay lean, but I think what many are missing in context is that an extended lean-gaining phase will never match bulkbuilding at the advanced level.
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Brian Johnston

Ontario, CAN

What you don't understand is HOW MUCH a person has to lose in order to get in competition condition, like Andrew (who is slighter than some) who still needs to lose 20-30 pounds, yet he is not FAT in off-season condition. The same with Josh, in that anyone looking at him would not think him FAT in the least in off-season condition. That's the difference. And all that weight Josh needs to lose is not all fat, but a good part water (which occurs naturally as the body reduces).
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Turpin

Trentine looks FAT & watery ( even in the face/jowls ) ... and in the rear shots Ive been sent he looks awful ( no hams , calves or back muscularity evident at all in either size or separation )... So much for Ren-ex.

T.
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JONKILCOYNE

Florida, USA

Josh's physique reminds me of a mix of Steve Reeves and Boyer Coe especially w the beard.

Hope him and Andrew kill it at the competition!
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HeavyHitter32

Tomislav wrote:
HeavyHitter32 wrote:
Getting fat can also lower testosterone levels and create other hormonal imbalances not ideal for muscular gains.


HeavyHitter,
not necessarily; leptin bypasses the HPTA to increase T levels.


It's well documented - and beyond debate - that lower testosterone is associated with higher levels of bodyfat.

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Tika

Florida, USA

Turpin wrote:
Trentine looks FAT & watery ( even in the face/jowls ) ... and in the rear shots Ive been sent he looks awful ( no hams , calves or back muscularity evident at all in either size or separation )... So much for Ren-ex.

T.


Hi Turpin,

Are you counting Joshy out already? He didn't turn pro by coming in out of shape. He is still 7 weeks out in the pics. If this is fat and watery I need to change my description of what I look for in a man.

Tika
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Turpin

Tika wrote:
Turpin wrote:
Trentine looks FAT & watery ( even in the face/jowls ) ... and in the rear shots Ive been sent he looks awful ( no hams , calves or back muscularity evident at all in either size or separation )... So much for Ren-ex.

T.

Hi Turpin,

Are you counting Joshy out already? He didn't turn pro by coming in out of shape. He is still 7 weeks out in the pics. If this is fat and watery I need to change my description of what I look for in a man.

Tika


Pushing/reminding of Trentine`s `pro` status only makes things appear worse.

Wheres his hams / calves or mid-low back definition ?
Lighting that creates severe shadow ( as with the tricep ) would/should create similar effect in the areas of muscularity mentioned ( IF the muscularity is suffice / present in the first instance )

T.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Brian Johnston wrote:
What you don't understand is HOW MUCH a person has to lose in order to get in competition condition, like Andrew (who is slighter than some) who still needs to lose 20-30 pounds, yet he is not FAT in off-season condition. The same with Josh, in that anyone looking at him would not think him FAT in the least in off-season condition. That's the difference. And all that weight Josh needs to lose is not all fat, but a good part water (which occurs naturally as the body reduces).


==Scott==
I agree Brian. I think what Tomi calls bulking up is quite different than most on here consider bulking. I could be wrong but Tomi's poster child for bulking is Bruce Randall. He bulked up to look like the Michelin man and then somehow lost much of it and returned to normal size thinking it helped him gain more muscle.

Whether it actually did no one knows. I don't think a smart bodybuilder wants to go to the aggravation of having to lose so much blubber weight to get into contest shape even if being so fat did give him an advantage in gaining muscle . I think there's something to be said for being a little over weight as Joshua is before contest time to ensure he's getting adequate nutrition but just getting fat with the idea that all those extra pounds ensures more muscle just doesn't make much sense.
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Tomislav

New York, USA

entsminger wrote:

I think there's something to be said for being a little over weight as Joshua is before contest time to ensure he's getting adequate nutrition but just getting fat with the idea that all those extra pounds ensures more muscle just doesn't make much sense.


Scott,
where did you get that idea?? Josh bulked up 60 lbs over contest weight.
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Tomislav

New York, USA

Brian Johnston wrote:
What you don't understand is HOW MUCH...


Come off it already; all you can do is shout or make creepy posts; throwing insults and repeatedly claiming I'm lying is silly and it only fools Scott.

Josh didn't leangain otherwise he would be coming in the same size, just like advanced leangainers do.
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AShortt

Ontario, CAN

Ok now don't mix this up with Josh please. I think Josh needed the break from competition so inevitably his first comp back would require a big diet.

For me it has been the exact opposite of what Tommy has been saying (individuality ;?) I stayed quite lean since last year and this contest prep has been very different. I look significantly leaner without much of a drop in body weight. My strength and muscle increases were better this year than the previous where I stayed at a higher bodyfat%. I have just felt better in general and looked better.

Regards,
Andrew
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Brian Johnston

Ontario, CAN

WHEN I CAPITALIZE, I'M NOT YELLING... PLEASE STORE THAT IN YOUR DATA BANK. I CAPITALIZE TO SHOW OR DEMONSTRATE IMPORTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!! Now, what you don't get, since you've NEVER BEEN THERE is that a drop of 60 pounds on a guy 6 feet or so is not that much relative to a cut condition for competition.

I've worked with competitive bodybuilders, and I've gotten that lean a few times in previous years and the drop is significant without the person looking fat (like you do) in the off-season. I HOPE THAT HELPS!!!!!!!!!!
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Tomislav

New York, USA

Brian,
I think you've miss the point about bulkbuilding; Josh doesn't have to drop 60 lbs this time around, probably just 40 - that leaves 20 lbs of additional lean mass gained from an extended bulkbuilding phase of five years.

Andrew,
you're in excellent shape, but if Josh does come in with 20 lbs more muscle you should give the strategy serious thought since those kind of results are tremendous at the advanced level, and IMO very doable if the athlete is willing to make the commitment; bulkbuilding is basic old-school forumla and it works.


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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Tomislav wrote:
entsminger wrote:

I think there's something to be said for being a little over weight as Joshua is before contest time to ensure he's getting adequate nutrition but just getting fat with the idea that all those extra pounds ensures more muscle just doesn't make much sense.

Scott,
where did you get that idea?? Josh bulked up 60 lbs over contest weight.


==Scott==
I look at a bodybuilder in contest shape as something like a person in a concentration camp as far as fat is concerned. They go way below anything natural or even healthy to get that ripped to shreds look. For a big guy around 6 ft or over 60 pounds does not make him look like baby huey.In real world applications I wouldn't consider Joshua fat between contests. He just looks like a normal human being. Having some fat on the body isn't what I consider being fat, that's normal. Having too much fat like Chris Farley is fat. Too fat.That fat doesn't help build muscle.
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