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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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Arthur Jones and Steroids
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SWISS-HIT

Dear Dr. Darden

My favorite book is the Nautilus Bodybuilding Book from 1986. Still my "bible" when it comes to HIT-Training and Nautilus-Nostalgia.

But I have to ask you a question which bothers me a lot:

Arthur Jones, i assume on purpose, chose big bodybuilders to promote his machines. Schwarzenegger, Mentzers, Viator and so on. In the Nautilus Bodybuilding Book.

It is said that Jones was totally against steroids. And in the book itself there is a whole chapter about steroids and here it comes that they are useless and have no effect on muscle growth.

All the names I mentioned where heavy, heavy steroid users?

How comes that a smart guy like Jones was not aware that his Bodybuilders were on steroids and why would he say that they are useless when it comes to muscle growth?

Another Problem is that in retro perspective all the studies done with Bodybuilders back then were totally useless since steroids would change the requirements?

Was it just for the money?

PS: HIT works for me but please answer me my questions.

Greets from Switzerland
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

It is said that Jones was totally against steroids. And in the book itself there is a whole chapter about steroids and here it comes that they are useless and have no effect on muscle growth.

All the names I mentioned where heavy, heavy steroid users?

How comes that a smart guy like Jones was not aware that his Bodybuilders were on steroids and why would he say that they are useless when it comes to muscle growth?

==Scott==
I believe I read somewhere that Jones knew Sergio was on steroids when he was at Deland but he allowed him to continue on them.Jones was too smart to have not known the advantages of steroids on muscle growth. It sounded good to the average sap to hear from him that steroids were useless.Gee, I use Nautilus I get big!!
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Ellington Darden

During the 1970s, Jones was against steroids. The published research at that time said they did not work. None of the researchers, however, realized that bodybuilders were taking such MASSIVE doses in combination with MASSIVE doses. Jones and I knew that many bodybuilders were on steroids, but we too were surprised by the amounts consumed.

Jones liked being surrounded by huge guys, many of whom told him they were clean. Later he found out he had been duped.

Jones always believed that proper exercise and genetics were the keys to becoming big and strong. To him, drugs were very minor.

Ellington
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Ellington Darden wrote:
During the 1970s, Jones was against steroids. The published research at that time said they did not work. None of the researchers, however, realized that bodybuilders were taking such MASSIVE doses in combination with MASSIVE doses. Jones and I knew that many bodybuilders were on steroids, but we too were surprised by the amounts consumed.

Jones liked being surrounded by huge guys, many of whom told him they were clean. Later he found out he had been duped.

Jones always believed that proper exercise and genetics were the keys to becoming big and strong. To him, drugs were very minor.

Ellington


==Scott==
I guess if Jones was duped I wasn't as dumb as I thought I was in those days because as early as the the late 60's and early 70s I knew the likes of Coe and Sergio and others were on large doses or Steroids. Heck in my 68 69 high school class there were kids who were cramming down steroids like french fries! An average kid benching near 400.There's no way one could think that Sergio was natural.I'm sure Jones just looked the other way.

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Jesse Lee Otis

Dr. Darden --

I well imagine that you remember John Grimek. I read about him and remember that Jones commented on John's considerable size & strength (said attributes being relative to those of the time that Grimek was training).

Are you at liberty to say whether Grimek ever involved with steroids at all?


Jesse Lee
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Ellington Darden

Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
Dr. Darden --

I well imagine that you remember John Grimek. I read about him and remember that Jones commented on John's considerable size & strength (said attributes being relative to those of the time that Grimek was training).

Are you at liberty to say whether Grimek ever involved with steroids at all?


Jesse Lee


Jesse Lee,

I talked with John Grimek many times during the 1970s, but I never discussed steroids with him. Grimek had great size and strength before steroids became popular, so I doubt he ever took them.

Ellington

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entsminger

Virginia, USA

==Scott==
I read an article way back in a Hoffman magazine that at one point Grimek had dabbled with some kind of steroid for a short stint but as Ellington says he was already big and strong at that time and was just experimenting.
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Jesse Lee Otis

Thanks to Dr. Darden and Scott Entsminger for their reply regarding John Grimek.

Jesse Lee
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Jesse Lee Otis

What is the current thinking on Jones' feelings about Casey being on steroids? Jones trained him at length and must have known about his 'nutrition' habits.

Jesse Lee

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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
What is the current thinking on Jones' feelings about Casey being on steroids? Jones trained him at length and must have known about his 'nutrition' habits.

Jesse Lee



== Scott ==
Jones feelings is a debatable topic with no clear answer . I can only guess Jones didn?t want him on the drugs to prove that casey did what he did drug free. Wheather or not Casey was doing drugs has been argued on here over and over again.
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backtrack

They were all on drugs, only a goon would believe otherwise.
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CD51

backtrack wrote:
They were all on drugs, only a goon would believe otherwise.


And the guys at the top always will be. The question is so what? And yes, they a lot of them have great genetics as well.

A little personal story from high school. I sat with a recruiter from Michigan to watch high school game film. I played center and was good enough to be recruited by that level of school. After about 15 minutes the recruiter stopped the film at the conclusion of a play where we scored a 35 yardrushing touchdown. He shut off the projector. He turned to me and said ?you made three blocks in that one play, that is more than we would ever ask of any of our linemen. But you will never be 300lbs.? We shook hands as he left. He knew that even with the drugs I did not have the frame to carry that kind of weight.

So at the top level of a sport the guys that make it have inherited physical attributes that, when combined with drugs, good training, nutrition and a lot of hard work, get them as big and strong as they need to be.
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Jesse Lee Otis

Check this guy out --


Jesse Lee
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Bill Sekerak

California, USA

I remember reading somewhere that German researchers had developed some form of steroid and that they tested it on German soldiers during WWII. I have no idea if this is valid or not however it does seem plausible , to some extent , considering what lengths these people were willing to go to in order to produce the German Superman. Combine that with their complete lack of ethics and how brilliant some of their researchers were.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
Check this guy out --


Jesse Lee


== Scott==
That looks like some kind of photo shop nonscence??
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backtrack

The genetics argument is bullshit -bodybuilder genetics aren't in everyone but they're definitely not rare.
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HeavyHitter32

backtrack wrote:
The genetics argument is bullshit -bodybuilder genetics aren't in everyone but they're definitely not rare.


Keep in mind some people respond much better than others when it comes to steroids. A lot of it depends on the individual's receptors.

So, you could have one bodybuilder who has great genetics, but poor receptors who will not gain tremendously on roids....where as another bodybuilder might have "decent" or pretty good genetics, but outstanding receptors who will gain A LOT on roids and make it to a higher level of competing than the other guy.

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entsminger

Virginia, USA

== Scott==
It?s just like Einstein , there?s only a hand full of people who have the potential to be as smart as he was . There?s only a hand full of Arnold?s or Sergio?s but that doesn?t mean the rest of us can?t be real smart or big ass bodybuilders. Like Wilt Chamberlain there are only a few with the genetics to be 7 foot tall and be as good as he was. The rest of us may not be 7 feet tall but we can still score big in other ways!
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Jesse Lee Otis

entsminger wrote:
Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
Check this guy out --
Jesse Lee

== Scott==
That looks like some kind of photo shop nonscence??


================================

ha! :-) Here is a pic of him standing next to a couple of 'normal' guys --


Jesse Lee

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entsminger

Virginia, USA

Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
entsminger wrote:
Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
Check this guy out --
Jesse Lee

== Scott==
That looks like some kind of photo shop nonscence??

================================

ha! :-) Here is a pic of him standing next to a couple of 'normal' guys --


Jesse Lee



===Scott ==
Based on this picture he would have to be around 7 foot tall unless these? regular guys? are midgets?
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SWISS-HIT

entsminger wrote:
Ellington Darden wrote:
During the 1970s, Jones was against steroids. The published research at that time said they did not work. None of the researchers, however, realized that bodybuilders were taking such MASSIVE doses in combination with MASSIVE doses. Jones and I knew that many bodybuilders were on steroids, but we too were surprised by the amounts consumed.

Jones liked being surrounded by huge guys, many of whom told him they were clean. Later he found out he had been duped.

Jones always believed that proper exercise and genetics were the keys to becoming big and strong. To him, drugs were very minor.

Ellington

==Scott==
I guess if Jones was duped I wasn't as dumb as I thought I was in those days because as early as the the late 60's and early 70s I knew the likes of Coe and Sergio and others were on large doses or Steroids. Heck in my 68 69 high school class there were kids who were cramming down steroids like french fries! An average kid benching near 400.There's no way one could think that Sergio was natural.I'm sure Jones just looked the other way.



The more strange i find it, that there were, according to Nautilus Bodybuilding Book, 13 studies which showed that steroids do not work...
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ron33

entsminger wrote:
Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
entsminger wrote:
Jesse Lee Otis wrote:
Check this guy out --
Jesse Lee

== Scott==
That looks like some kind of photo shop nonscence??

================================

ha! :-) Here is a pic of him standing next to a couple of 'normal' guys --


Jesse Lee



===Scott ==
Based on this picture he would have to be around 7 foot tall unless these? regular guys? are midgets?


Think that's finally pic of ur bud Grant, after training once every 6 months...
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

The more strange i find it, that there were, according to Nautilus Bodybuilding Book, 13 studies which showed that steroids do not work...


==Scott==
Just goes to show a study can be made up to show whatever result you want. Nautilus or Jones or someone in the organization wanted to act like you could get huge just using Nautilus. It's never been proven that any bodybuilder got huge using only Nautilus or any other machine or method.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

===Scott ==
Based on this picture he would have to be around 7 foot tall unless these? regular guys? are midgets?

Think that's finally pic of ur bud Grant, after training once every 6 months...

==Scott==
I don't think he's big enough to be Grant?
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hit4me

Florida, USA

entsminger wrote:
The more strange i find it, that there were, according to Nautilus Bodybuilding Book, 13 studies which showed that steroids do not work...


==Scott==
Just goes to show a study can be made up to show whatever result you want. Nautilus or Jones or someone in the organization wanted to act like you could get huge just using Nautilus. It's never been proven that any bodybuilder got huge using only Nautilus or any other machine or method.


but was Jones trying to market to the bodybuilder or to the general public to use nautilus for fitness reasons......if you look at the nautilus commercials back then, the guys and gals in the commercials were not huge by any means
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